independent and unofficial
Prince fan community
Forum jump
Forums > Politics & Religion > all the confederate statues coming down
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Page 1 of 9 123456789>
Reply   New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
Author

Tweet     Share

Message
Thread started 06/13/20 3:48pm

cborgman

avatar

all the confederate statues coming down

200611032704-richmond-jefferson-davis-statue-pulled-down-super-169.jpg


i love it, especially considering so many of them went up as trolling during periods where black rights were advancing.


why should we be honoring traitors to america who fought to keep black people enslaved?

participation trophies for bigots is a really stupid idea to begin with and they only serve to enable the current day bigots and to gleefully rub black americans faces in the atrocities we as a country forced upon them.


its LONG overdue that we take them down and i am glad to see it FINALLY happening.



.

[Edited 6/13/20 16:03pm]

Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #1 posted 06/13/20 4:19pm

poppys

New Orleans May 2017 - Mayor Mitch Landrieu took 4 statues down after Wynton Marsalis suggested it.

dscn3749.jpg20170520_065643_AP17140035997598_300.jpgGeneral-Lee-statue-steps-down-in-New-Orleans.jpg?fit=600%2C901

"if you can't clap on the one, then don't clap at all"
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #2 posted 06/13/20 4:22pm

cborgman

avatar

the people took down the columbus statue in minne, and a lot of people are petitioning to have it replaced with a statue of prince, which i love.

Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #3 posted 06/13/20 4:30pm

poppys

This just happened today. It was unplanned, some people got arrested.

Watch: New Orleans protesters take down statue of John McDonogh, toss it in Mississippi River

https://www.nola.com/news/crime_police/article_f3132588-adc5-11ea-9d07-33279ea39f38.html

[Edited 6/13/20 16:35pm]

"if you can't clap on the one, then don't clap at all"
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #4 posted 06/13/20 4:32pm

poppys

cborgman said:

the people took down the columbus statue in minne, and a lot of people are petitioning to have it replaced with a statue of prince, which i love.


Right, but that petition was started 3 years ago. I signed it.

"if you can't clap on the one, then don't clap at all"
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #5 posted 06/13/20 5:25pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

poppys said:

This just happened today. It was unplanned, some people got arrested.

Watch: New Orleans protesters take down statue of John McDonogh, toss it in Mississippi River

https://www.nola.com/news/crime_police/article_f3132588-adc5-11ea-9d07-33279ea39f38.html

[Edited 6/13/20 16:35pm]


I do not like these statues... I do not like the so called confederate flag. I say even if people who display them are not meaning to be racist they should know that is how it is viewed and that alone should be enough to no display them. BUT Free Speech Must Prevail. Property Rights Must be protected. Someday someone will be killed trying to steal a flag and that will be a justified act. (I hold that deadly foce should be allowed to protect property as well as life or limb)

they should be arrested and charged and tried... if this was that important to them they should be happy to go to prison.

Those statues did not violate anyone's rights. And I have said before and I say again: those that support this best remember this as one day someone will come and tear down something they like...

The Spike is Real Wear a Mask (this is not the 2nd Wave)
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #6 posted 06/13/20 5:28pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

cborgman said:

the people took down the columbus statue in minne, and a lot of people are petitioning to have it replaced with a statue of prince, which i love.

i do not like it and he would think it demonic... but if that is what people want what do i care?

The Spike is Real Wear a Mask (this is not the 2nd Wave)
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #7 posted 06/13/20 5:30pm

jjhunsecker

avatar

Why should the losers get monuments and military bases named in their honor anyway? All traces of these traitors to our country should be wiped out, or put in a museum with the other relics
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #8 posted 06/13/20 5:32pm

cborgman

avatar

jjhunsecker said:

Why should the losers get monuments and military bases named in their honor anyway? All traces of these traitors to our country should be wiped out, or put in a museum with the other relics

exactly

Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #9 posted 06/13/20 5:37pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

jjhunsecker said:

Why should the losers get monuments and military bases named in their honor anyway? All traces of these traitors to our country should be wiped out, or put in a museum with the other relics

I do not know... that is not a reason to destroy them... and again I kind of mostly agree that they should come down. But then someday the mob will come for something you like... the same mindset... the same Cancel CULTure MOB mentality to destroy anything they do not like is why we did not get "Extra Lovable" and "Lust U Always" that is why a movie i have never seen is being taken away that is why some want to ban Paw Patrol... we live in a world over run by thin skinned people who feel that they have a right to NOT be offend...

The Spike is Real Wear a Mask (this is not the 2nd Wave)
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #10 posted 06/13/20 5:45pm

cborgman

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:

we live in a world over run by thin skinned people who feel that they have a right to NOT be offend...

falloff

irony.

Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #11 posted 06/13/20 6:22pm

IanRG

jjhunsecker said:

Why should the losers get monuments and military bases named in their honor anyway? All traces of these traitors to our country should be wiped out, or put in a museum with the other relics

.

And this is how you balance keeping and recognising the full history. As has been pointed out, so many of these were put up in places of undue honour as a knee jerk reaction against calls for civil rights long after your civil war. They were put up by racists to honour racists and deny the reasonable requests of the abused to not be shot, excessively imprisoned and excluded from so much of the benefits of being US citizens. They are being protected by those seeking to keep institutional racism going.

.

Put them in museums with full explanations of history of these people and times, good and bad, and Only's comments about free speech and what if they come for the symbols you like dies for the silliness it always has been. Made even more silly because Only has stated time and time again, the second amendment is there to allow the people to keep the government in line - yet he denys the rights of others (people on the left or not white) to resist government violence.

.

In Australia we are going through the same thing: Ayres Rock was returned to its Indigenous name, Uluru in a two step: Ayers Rock / Uluru in 1993 and now Uluru / Ayers Rock since 2002 (with virtually only the far right calling it Ayers Rock). The King Leopold Ranges are to be renamed following BLM. People have attacked Capt Cook, Governor Macquarie, John Batman and Queen Victoria statutes. These are not as clear cut as confederate symbols so it needs to be more nuanced. IMHO Batman and Macquarie statues should be moved to museums, but Cook was just an explorer. Cook was no Columbus, it was Cook's funder and "botanist", Joseph Banks, that pushed for the colonisation of Australia. Cook's worst acts were in Hawai'i and it cost him his life. No deserves a monument and no monument must stay in prime places of honour forever. Those so honoured should be able to be honoured by virtually all people in a country.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #12 posted 06/13/20 6:27pm

2elijah

avatar

cborgman said:



OnlyNDaUsa said:



we live in a world over run by thin skinned people who feel that they have a right to NOT be offend...



falloff

irony.


Say it again. falloff falloff
Always smile in the face of adversity. smile
#NOFEAR
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #13 posted 06/13/20 6:34pm

cborgman

avatar

IanRG said:

jjhunsecker said:

Why should the losers get monuments and military bases named in their honor anyway? All traces of these traitors to our country should be wiped out, or put in a museum with the other relics

.

And this is how you balance keeping and recognising the full history. As has been pointed out, so many of these were put up in places of undue honour as a knee jerk reaction against calls for civil rights long after your civil war. They were put up by racists to honour racists and deny the reasonable requests of the abused to not be shot, excessively imprisoned and excluded from so much of the benefits of being US citizens. They are being protected by those seeking to keep institutional racism going.

.

Put them in museums with full explanations of history of these people and times, good and bad, and Only's comments about free speech and what if they come for the symbols you like dies for the silliness it always has been. Made even more silly because Only has stated time and time again, the second amendment is there to allow the people to keep the government in line - yet he denys the rights of others (people on the left or not white) to resist government violence.

.

In Australia we are going through the same thing: Ayres Rock was returned to its Indigenous name, Uluru in a two step: Ayers Rock / Uluru in 1993 and now Uluru / Ayers Rock since 2002 (with virtually only the far right calling it Ayers Rock). The King Leopold Ranges are to be renamed following BLM. People have attacked Capt Cook, Governor Macquarie, John Batman and Queen Victoria statutes. These are not as clear cut as confederate symbols so it needs to be more nuanced. IMHO Batman and Macquarie statues should be moved to museums, but Cook was just an explorer. Cook was no Columbus, it was Cook's funder and "botanist", Joseph Banks, that pushed for the colonisation of Australia. Cook's worst acts were in Hawai'i and it cost him his life. No deserves a monument and no monument must stay in prime places of honour forever. Those so honoured should be able to be honoured by virtually all people in a country.

this.

Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #14 posted 06/13/20 6:39pm

cborgman

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:

Property Rights Must be protected. Someday someone will be killed trying to steal a flag and that will be a justified act.

youre LITERALLY victim-blaming future victims.

you're SPECIFICALLY saying if someone steals a flag, their murders are proactively "justified"

good. fucking. GOD.

listen to yourself!

.


[Edited 6/13/20 18:41pm]

Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #15 posted 06/13/20 6:41pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

cborgman said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

Property Rights Must be protected. Someday someone will be killed trying to steal a flag and that will be a justified act.

youre LITERALLY victim-blaming future victims.

you're SPECIFICALLY saying if they steal a flag, their murders are proactively "justified"
good. fucking. GOD.

listen to yourself!

goes for any property... Yes. (that is the private owner of said property)

state property not so much...

[Edited 6/13/20 18:43pm]

The Spike is Real Wear a Mask (this is not the 2nd Wave)
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #16 posted 06/13/20 6:43pm

cborgman

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:

cborgman said:

youre LITERALLY victim-blaming future victims.

you're SPECIFICALLY saying if they steal a flag, their murders are proactively "justified"
good. fucking. GOD.

listen to yourself!

goes for any property... Yes.

disbelief
seek help only.

Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #17 posted 06/13/20 6:45pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

cborgman said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

goes for any property... Yes.

disbelief
seek help only.

if you were being robbed would not not want to be allowed to use force to stop it?


I see this a lot in people that have never been the victim of a crime... they think "oh just let them" "go to your happy place" "close your eyes it will be over soon...."

Some RATHER be a victim... but see they forget one thing... it is only because some will use deadly force that prevents some from breaking the law.

[Edited 6/13/20 18:47pm]

The Spike is Real Wear a Mask (this is not the 2nd Wave)
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #18 posted 06/13/20 6:49pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

what if mobs went after statues of civil rights leaders? "Oh that's not the same!" Bull it is Identical. *it is not the target or what it represents but that fact that it is not yours!

The Spike is Real Wear a Mask (this is not the 2nd Wave)
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #19 posted 06/13/20 6:51pm

2elijah

avatar

Good, take those racist symbols down! clapping clapping
Always smile in the face of adversity. smile
#NOFEAR
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #20 posted 06/13/20 6:56pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

2elijah said:

Good, take those racist symbols down! clapping clapping

by mob force? if so then will you clap when icons you think are okay or even like are treated the same?

The Spike is Real Wear a Mask (this is not the 2nd Wave)
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #21 posted 06/13/20 6:58pm

2elijah

avatar

jjhunsecker said:

Why should the losers get monuments and military bases named in their honor anyway? All traces of these traitors to our country should be wiped out, or put in a museum with the other relics

Exactly.
Always smile in the face of adversity. smile
#NOFEAR
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #22 posted 06/13/20 7:01pm

cborgman

avatar

2elijah said:

Good, take those racist symbols down! clapping clapping

LONG overdue

Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Lord Acton
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #23 posted 06/13/20 7:08pm

13cjk13

avatar

cborgman said:

2elijah said:

Good, take those racist symbols down! clapping clapping

LONG overdue

Racist, treasonous murderers are the same as civil rights leaders. I just learned that.

"hey if you found out someone gave you a fake $20 would you be mad?"It is in fact #TRUTH
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #24 posted 06/13/20 7:20pm

IanRG

OnlyNDaUsa said:

what if mobs went after statues of civil rights leaders? "Oh that's not the same!" Bull it is Identical. *it is not the target or what it represents but that fact that it is not yours!

.

You are missing the point - IT IS THE TARGET AND WHAT THEY REPRESENT. That is the very point.

.

The only statutes in honoured places should be because they are ours (ie for all people in that town, state or country). There should be none that are put up because they acted so badly against the other downtrodden side. A person fighting for equal rights for all by raising up the downtrodden is not a person that is for their own side and unreasonably against the other.

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #25 posted 06/13/20 7:33pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

IanRG said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

what if mobs went after statues of civil rights leaders? "Oh that's not the same!" Bull it is Identical. *it is not the target or what it represents but that fact that it is not yours!

.

You are missing the point - IT IS THE TARGET AND WHAT THEY REPRESENT. That is the very point.

.

The only statutes in honoured places should be because they are ours (ie for all people in that town, state or country). There should be none that are put up because they acted so badly against the other downtrodden side. A person fighting for equal rights for all by raising up the downtrodden is not a person that is for their own side and unreasonably against the other.

so only honor the ones you LIKE? and again do you really want Mob rule? do you trust that they will will never go too far?

The Spike is Real Wear a Mask (this is not the 2nd Wave)
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #26 posted 06/13/20 7:45pm

IanRG

OnlyNDaUsa said:

IanRG said:

.

You are missing the point - IT IS THE TARGET AND WHAT THEY REPRESENT. That is the very point.

.

The only statutes in honoured places should be because they are ours (ie for all people in that town, state or country). There should be none that are put up because they acted so badly against the other downtrodden side. A person fighting for equal rights for all by raising up the downtrodden is not a person that is for their own side and unreasonably against the other.

so only honor the ones you LIKE? and again do you really want Mob rule? do you trust that they will will never go too far?

.

You are still missing the point and not even trying to see beyond your Fox and co sourced arguments.

.

Those who should be honoured has nothing to do with what one person or one side likes - this is your lie to create another false equivalence between enemies of the state in your civil war and people seeking equal rights for all with the civil rights movement.

.

This is not mob rule - it is a reaction against the mob rule that put these statues up as statements against civil rights and refused to consider that those honoured should be those who tried to do good for all.

.

Did the mob rule go too far in deliberately putting up statues of enemies of the state who sought to perpetuate slavery to show the descedents of these very slaves that the descedents of the slave owners are still the mob that rules?

[Edited 6/13/20 19:47pm]

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #27 posted 06/13/20 7:56pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

IanRG said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

so only honor the ones you LIKE? and again do you really want Mob rule? do you trust that they will will never go too far?

.

You are still missing the point and not even trying to see beyond your Fox and co sourced arguments.

.

Those who should be honoured has nothing to do with what one person or one side likes - this is your lie to create another false equivalence between enemies of the state in your civil war and people seeking equal rights for all with the civil rights movement.

.

This is not mob rule - it is a reaction against the mob rule that put these statues up as statements against civil rights and refused to consider that those honoured should be those who tried to do good for all.

.

Did the mob rule go too far in deliberately putting up statues of enemies of the state who sought to perpetuate slavery to show the descedents of these very slaves that the descedents of the slave owners are still the mob that rules?

[Edited 6/13/20 19:47pm]



I get it and I agree they need to come down... I do not watch fox... so please stop making up that falsehood


who are you to say who should and who should not be honored?

are you saying that a mod did not tear down them down?

do you have any support that a mob put them up?

The Spike is Real Wear a Mask (this is not the 2nd Wave)
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #28 posted 06/13/20 8:21pm

IanRG

OnlyNDaUsa said:

IanRG said:

.

You are still missing the point and not even trying to see beyond your Fox and co sourced arguments.

.

Those who should be honoured has nothing to do with what one person or one side likes - this is your lie to create another false equivalence between enemies of the state in your civil war and people seeking equal rights for all with the civil rights movement.

.

This is not mob rule - it is a reaction against the mob rule that put these statues up as statements against civil rights and refused to consider that those honoured should be those who tried to do good for all.

.

Did the mob rule go too far in deliberately putting up statues of enemies of the state who sought to perpetuate slavery to show the descedents of these very slaves that the descedents of the slave owners are still the mob that rules?

[Edited 6/13/20 19:47pm]



I get it and I agree they need to come down... I do not watch fox... so please stop making up that falsehood


who are you to say who should and who should not be honored?

are you saying that a mod did not tear down them down?

do you have any support that a mob put them up?

.

The source of your arguments from what is being said by fox AND CO. This has been shown time and time again. I did not say you watch just fox. Instead, I have shown that your arguments here are so often a day or two after that argument was first said or written in far right media outlets - Fox TV, radio and online and similar but different online radio and websites etc, so please stop making up falsehoods.

.

You are still missing the point - I am no one to say who should or should not be honoured. The whole of the local community is the only people that should say this. When only a part of the community - the descendents of slave owners - is the mob who chose to put up statues of those who militarily opposed the USA to prevent the end of slavery as a response to the descendents of slaves seeking equal rights, then who is this mod to choose to honour these enemies of the state? Who are you to parrot Fox and Co's arguments for their mob against the whole of the community?

.

If the ruling mob responded to all the previous calls to reflect on the appropriateness of statues of enemies of the state as a counter to the call for civil rights then no mob would seek to have them removed - They would have been removed long ago.

.

No I do not support the mobs of racist white supremacists that got so many of these statues of enemies of the state put up to stick it to those seeking equal rights.

[Edited 6/13/20 20:23pm]

 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #29 posted 06/13/20 8:40pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

IanRG said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:



I get it and I agree they need to come down... I do not watch fox... so please stop making up that falsehood


who are you to say who should and who should not be honored?

are you saying that a mod did not tear down them down?

do you have any support that a mob put them up?

.

The source of your arguments from what is being said by fox AND CO. This has been shown time and time again. I did not say you watch just fox. Instead, I have shown that your arguments here are so often a day or two after that argument was first said or written in far right media outlets - Fox TV, radio and online and similar but different online radio and websites etc, so please stop making up falsehoods.

.

You are still missing the point - I am no one to say who should or should not be honoured. The whole of the local community is the only people that should say this. When only a part of the community - the descendents of slave owners - is the mob who chose to put up statues of those who militarily opposed the USA to prevent the end of slavery as a response to the descendents of slaves seeking equal rights, then who is this mod to choose to honour these enemies of the state? Who are you to parrot Fox and Co's arguments for their mob against the whole of the community?

.

If the ruling mob responded to all the previous calls to reflect on the appropriateness of statues of enemies of the state as a counter to the call for civil rights then no mob would seek to have them removed - They would have been removed long ago.

.

No I do not support the mobs of racist white supremacists that got so many of these statues of enemies of the state put up to stick it to those seeking equal rights.

[Edited 6/13/20 20:23pm]

I do not watch fox... no one has even shown that i do... the best was someone made up a lie that FOX says "Cheer the Virus" I said they do not... not because I watch it but becuase I was and am sure it was a made up...and they never proved it... again please stop making up falsehoods about me.

that is MOB rule... you agree with it so you support it... watch out.

if you support it now that is fine just remeber this when it comed for you... remember not too long ago most people were opposed to same sex marrage not too long ago most were opposed to most abortions...

so you pick and choose based on your point of view? I got that... that was my point the one you missed.

The Spike is Real Wear a Mask (this is not the 2nd Wave)
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Page 1 of 9 123456789>
Reply   New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Forums > Politics & Religion > all the confederate statues coming down